racial discrimination

jasmine_lily · PJNet Newbie Joined: Jun 18, 2008 Posts: 8

what is up with people renting out homes who only want tenants from a specific race (eg:chinese only)
i do not understand what difference it makes as long as everyone can get along
it really bothers me Confused

smartringgit · PJNet Starter Joined: Jun 09, 2008 Posts: 65

Sometime it may not be discrimation but it could be because of certain circumstances.

You mentioned renting out 'homes', which is rare for preferences. It is normally renting out rooms are of specific preference of the tenants. Some prefer female and some prefer male. Some prefer single, some married couple and some retiree.

Reasons for preference of tenants for a House Renting:
1) The neighbourhood preference
2) Easy communication for rental collection
3) Bad experiences with certain group of people for damaging the property or bad payers
4) Things that the tenants might bring in to the house is not welcomed.

Now the preference of ethnic group could contribute to one above reason.

Then you mentioned 'everyone can get along', are you refering to room renting?

For room renting is even better reason for preference of certain ethnic:
1) The land lord/lady can communicate better
2) The food and culture is similar, so no barrier

Ultimately a Home/House environment is different from Neighbourhood environment or Office environment.
At house/room is where you let go all your personality...which different group of people would have different preference.

So is nothing wrong for ethnic preference.

jasmine_lily · PJNet Newbie Joined: Jun 18, 2008 Posts: 8

That is not how it is. i've had experience as i've been searching for an apartment to rent for the past 2 months but still havent found one.
there are owners who actually lie and say that the unit has been rented out when it hasnt and refuse to answer calls when they know we're non-chinese. it isnt even done politely.

as for the reason you've given,
1. if the owner is malaysian, he/she should not have a problem communicating in english or malay
2. how can the owner judge a group of people from the same race if one person does not pay rent? are they trying to say that malays/indians/etc are not able to afford the same rent?
3. again, race has nothing to do with property damage. it is not right to judge a whole group of people because of 1 person's mistake.
4. what are the things which are not welcome? owner should specify
if certain items are not allowed.

when i mentioned 'everyone can get along' i was referring to room as well as the whole apartment.

i notice that this 'rule' or 'preferance' only occur mainly for chinese owners. im not trying to be racist and say that all landlords are the same. but most of them are like this.
i understand when certain people only want tenants of a certain gender or age group.
but race should not be a barrier.
if everyone only wants chinese tenants, what are people from the other races going to do? will they not have a place to stay?

these are the common misconceptions of the owners about having non-chinese tenants
1. we are not able to afford the rent
2. we will not keep the place clean
3. we will bring in items which will not be liked by other tenants
4. language

im sure many people are facing the same problem and are equally bugged by this

this is not how things should be especially in this country.
however, thank you very much for ur feedback. i do appreciate it
Smile

smartringgit · PJNet Starter Joined: Jun 09, 2008 Posts: 65

“That is not how it is. i've had experience as i've been searching for an apartment to rent for the past 2 months but still havent found one. there are owners who actually lie and say that the unit has been rented out when it hasnt and refuse to answer calls when they know we're non-chinese. it isnt even done politely.“
How your conversation with the property owner I do not know but your statement of ‘non-chinese’ and refusal to talk to you is very ambiguous. When a property owner advertise to the public an offer to rent, has all the right to choose who to rent to. How sure are you the property were not rented out and how sure are you that your persistent pampering is not a hassle or harassment to other people? Is very easy for people not in their shoes to say they are misbehaving, when over times, they have seen and been through bad experiences.
“as for the reason you've given,
1. if the owner is malaysian, he/she should not have a problem communicating in english or malay”
This is also not 100% true…some Chinese/Indians do not speak neither or some Malays who do not speak English. There is nothing wrong not knowing these 2 languages or even illiterate but just knowing how to converse in their mother tongue. These people can own not just one but many properties.
“2. how can the owner judge a group of people from the same race if one person does not pay rent? are they trying to say that malays/indians/etc are not able to afford the same rent?”
This is not true, because experiences speak by themselves. Again let me emphasize it is no ethnic discrimination on the whole. Maybe Mr.A had a very bad experiencing renting his condo to ethnic X, and he would not rent it again next to ethnic X. However when he is back to business , he deal with ethnic X,Y,Z and his neighbor are of ethnic X,Y,Z also. Basically this is only a preference based on circumstances…so is definitely a NO NO of discrimination.
“3. again, race has nothing to do with property damage. it is not right to judge a whole group of people because of 1 person's mistake.”
Same thing like in 2), a person choice of tenants is not speaking as a whole to the person choice in other things. Well, property damage is in fact directly related to the culture of a person, some ethnic like to hang a lot of stuffs on the wall….which some other ethnic who like it untouched on the wall. In fact some ethnic forbid nailing in the house when an occupant of the property is pregnant. So the preference of tenants still applicable with ethnic choice, and again it doesn’t mean discrimination on the whole.

“4. what are the things which are not welcome? owner should specify if certain items are not allowed.”
This however is not always followed, some stuffs would be considered not right in the belief of the owner. So that is why to be safe they prefer to choose the people with their same culture. Again is NO NO of discrimination, a mere safeguard of preferences and avoiding dispute later.

“when i mentioned 'everyone can get along' i was referring to room as well as the whole apartment.”
for rooms, there are better reasons, why the owner can choose the tenants

“i notice that this 'rule' or 'preferance' only occur mainly for chinese owners. im not trying to be racist and say that all landlords are the same. but most of them are like this.”
This is ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE, maybe you are only so far dealing with the same type of people. For your information, there are certain LOTS only ALLOWED for certain ethnic…you call that discrimination? I call that preference or rule like you said. Every country and every home got its own set of rule to follow. Like removal of shoes before entering a house of some ethnic group is a respect. This is for protection, control, and etc….so is for GOOD….nothing wrong and certainly no discrimination.
“i understand when certain people only want tenants of a certain gender or age group.
but race should not be a barrier.”
Well same be it gender or race, is just a choice of the owner and is not like what you describe as discrimination. What is gender preference differ from race preference, if you call it discrimination…are all male only can commit harassment? If no barrier, then female only or male only also should not exist. So is very much for protection here.
“if everyone only wants chinese tenants, what are people from the other races going to do? will they not have a place to stay?”
You are just unlucky to have yet to find a right property owner that is willing to rent to you. It also plays a major role on how you negotiate with them. You have to understand, the property owner has all the right whether to rent to you as he/she need to PROTECT THE PROPERTY (based on bad experiences before). You may not feel it till you have a property to rent out.

“these are the common misconceptions of the owners about having non-chinese tenants
1. we are not able to afford the rent
2. we will not keep the place clean
3. we will bring in items which will not be liked by other tenants
4. language
im sure many people are facing the same problem and are equally bugged by this
this is not how things should be especially in this country. “
Are you also judging the certain amount of such preference of property owners as the whole of all property owners? So is same principal. It is just a mere preference from a property owner of the choice of tenants.
On the large are just mere preferences by certain group of people that are taken as discrimination just like you said. You just have to try looking and find one that is willing to rent to you. Your negotiation power is very important and do remember, the owner has all right whether to RENT or NOT TO RENT to you…as the advertisement is a mere invitation of offer. Remember that. Cool

ruby_red · PJNet Newbie Joined: Jun 20, 2008 Posts: 2

lols

jasmine_lily · PJNet Newbie Joined: Jun 18, 2008 Posts: 8

yes they have the right to choose whom they want to rent it out to. and i wasnt referring to owners who had already rented out the unit. some people whom i call say that the unit is available and then ask me my race, when they find out that im not a chinese, they immediately say that the unit has already been rented out. is it possible that withing 30 seconds, the unit has already been rented out? quite impossible isnt it? how sure are you that i've been persistently calling the owner? that is not the case here. when the owner says that he/she will get back to us in a day, it is only right that they do so. or say in the beginning that its only for chinese. however they do not answer calls despite saying that the unit is available. in my opinion that is very rude and unprofessional.

secondly, if the person does not speak english/malay, how are they able to put up an advert in one of the mentioned languages? maybe with help from a friend or relative perhaps? well, if they can get the help of this relative/friend to put up an ad, they should also be able to receive help if they cant communicate with the tenants.

third, it still isnt right to use a previous bad experience as an excuse. how sure are they that the mistake will repeat? if as u mentioned Mr.A can deal with people from different ethnics at his workplace/neighbours, why would it be a problem for him to rent a house to person from the same race? maybe ur trying to say that someone from race X didnt pay their rent on time, therefore mr.A chooses to only rent his unit out to people from his own race? is he trying to imply that just because that person is from his own race, he/she will pay the rent on time?

fourth, property damage is NOT directly related to the culture of a person. there is no such culture which causes property damage. nails are on the wall to hang up pictures. if the owner does not want that, all he/she has to do is say that pictures are not allowed to be put up on walls. here it might not be discrimination but its a false assumption.

i understand if someone wants a person from the same race to share a room with. but not when it comes to renting out a whole apartment or a single room.

i mentioned that MOST of the landlords only want chinese tenants. i didnt say ALL. i have come across some owners who are open minded about this and mention if there are certain restrictions in the house (eg. pay rent on time, no nails on walls)
as for the LOTS for certain ethnic, u must mean the bumi lots for malay citizens. im sure that many people are irritated with this rule, are they not? the bumiputra's receive many benefits in terms of prices of lots as well as preferance. this is a way is discrimination because malaysia is not a muslim country. its a multi racial nation. having bumi lots is contradicting the so called 'Malaysia as one nationality' concept.

gender and race are different. in college, you come across girls/boys hostel. this is to ensure the safety of the college students. but do u come across a chinese hostel/indian hostel/malay hostel? no, unless its an islamic university, etc. we are all human beings and no culture or religion teaches us to do wrong or damage anything. the only barrier might be language and that is not something that cant be overcome.

choosing someone from their own race is to PROTECT their property is not an excuse. that is like directly implying only people from their own race are able to follow rules and others are not. it is creating a gap of difference between them and others by ASSUMING things which are not true.

i am not judging them by their preferance. these are merely some of the reasons you mentioned in your first post for why they do not want tenants from a different race. i did not say that all owners are the same. again i would like to emphasize on the word MOST when im talking about the tenants.

smartringgit · PJNet Starter Joined: Jun 09, 2008 Posts: 65

The true RACE DISCRIMINATION is you, sorry to say that and this is because of this one:

LOTS for certain ethnic, u must mean the bumi lots for malay citizens. im sure that many people are irritated with this rule, are they not? the bumiputra's receive many benefits in terms of prices of lots as well as preferance. this is a way is discrimination because malaysia is not a muslim country. its a multi racial nation. having bumi lots is contradicting the so called 'Malaysia as one nationality' concept.

I am no BUMI, and I do not find this fair but I agree this is CORRECT. The reason is because if no such rules, the Chinese would bought all the units at every launch. Specifically some 10years ago...now maybe is more tally. Laughing

Why are you so calculative, you make sure you go get the early batch, if cannot get it here. then get it elsewhere. Is very simple, same thing for you looking for a place to settle. If people no accept you, keep looking for one that eventually accept you. Just like looking for an employment. Let me teach you a Chinese principal 'you fall, you get up and walk again', and 'when the horse is dead, get down and walk'.

Do not be feel small when someone turn down your offer to rent their property. Just continue to find one that is somehow willing to accept you. No one owe anything to rent to you, you must understand that. Laughing

I am trying to erase your thinking that such act of refusal to rent to you as race discrimination but a mere preference and a property owmer's RIGHTS. The only way to clear a muddy water is stay calm and wait for the dirty substances to sink, then you will enjoy a peaceful and serene environment. Wink

pencapchew · Posted: Sun Jun 22, 2008 3:39 pm Post subject: Re: racial discrimination

ashcrimson · PJNet Starter Joined: Sep 04, 2007 Posts: 257

Acacia · PJNet Newbie Joined: Jul 07, 2008 Posts: 1

As long as pride exists in man/woman, there will always be racial discrimination.
No wonder God hates pride.

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Symptoms of Asthma , Symptoms of Asthma Directory , Health Directory

Emily12 · PJNet Newbie Joined: Jul 08, 2008 Posts: 1

In racial discrimination, as long as pride exists in man/woman, there will always be racial discrimination.
No wonder God hates pride.

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Wheat Grass Benefits, Health Directory

potato990 · PJNet Starter Joined: Jan 12, 2008 Posts: 67

Not racial discrimination lah...

Stay together for me, no problem wan.

But, what if I have to restrict myelf ...cannot cook pork and eat pork?

Afterward, many misunderstanding...lagi susah ma.

My housemate is Indian, ok what...no prob...

danny · Posted: Fri Jul 11, 2008 2:56 pm Post subject:

I am chinese and my next door neighbor is indian and we get along super. Then they moved and another indian family moved in, they were jerks. My mom rented out her hse to many chinese and half of them were jerks (pay very late and even scold her for calling).

Basically, jerks come in all colors, race, shapes, etc.

Ironic · PJNet Starter Joined: Apr 24, 2008 Posts: 24

terry270383 · PJNet Starter Joined: Jun 24, 2008 Posts: 71

interesting
looks like a big fight
but all the points are so solid
maybe is because of the mindset that people grow up with
what the parents input to the children will influence them alot
Laughing